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Fórum » Only in English » Technologies » CO2 Lasers. (Anything relating to CO2 Lasers can be discussed here.)
CO2 Lasers.
Honk Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 01:41 | Üzenet/Post # 261
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Hi John
I have a feeling that I just don't know what it is I am doing. I don't know that this is an issue but I can make small drawings with your software and they are just great. I do use dither and I did on the file in question. I am questioning Mach3 on the size a file can be used in there program. This file is 47.5 MB  and Mach is slow just getting it all in. Maybe my computer isn't big or fast enough for something this big. The first picture shows how it does on smaller files and the second picture shows the third  attempt at the file in question.
Thanks again
Jerry

Csatolások/Attachments: 8457259.jpg(64Kb) · 8137635.jpg(105Kb)


Az üzenetet módosította/Modified by Honk - Szerda, 2013-07-10, 01:42
 
Dave Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 03:11 | Üzenet/Post # 262
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Jerry, I've had trouble with really large files on mach3 as well. Really large files got me into a situation where I couldn't even switch to the mdi screen and back. I wrote a small program to split the file into several smaller ones that mach seems to handle better.
 
My thoughts on the grounding issue:
- Your PSU board has a ground terminal in the picture you posted.
- Your BoB also has its own ground terminal.
- The parallel port also has ground pins (pin 18 trhough 25).
- Since the BoB is connected to the parallel port with a 25 pin cable, its ground is connected to the parallel port ground. The result is that the BoB has something to compare the data pin voltages to in order to determine if a line is high (5 volts relative to ground) or low (0 volts relative to ground).
If you just connect the BoB pin that drives the laser to the laser psu's ttl input, there's no ground reference for the psu to use to compare the signal to in order to tell if it is high or low.
That's why I think you need to tie the PSU gnd pin to the BoB gnd pin.
Dave
 
Honk Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 04:42 | Üzenet/Post # 263
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Dave
If I see this right, I need to run a ground wire from the DB25-GND terminal on the BoB to the GND terminal between the 20v terminal and the 5v terminal on the laser PSU.
I think?
Thanks Jerry
 
Dave Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 05:10 | Üzenet/Post # 264
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Jerry, yes, that's what I'm thinking. I'd use one of the gnd terminals at the lower right of the BoB picture you posted to the gnd terminal on the psu between the 5 and 20 volt pins. You might meter between the two board's ground pins just to make sure they're not wildly different voltages before you tie them together.
Dave
 
picengraver Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 11:51 | Üzenet/Post # 265
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Jerry,
I don't see anything in the code snippet you sent that would cause the issues you are experiencing.  Since you are using an axis direction pin for TTL control of your laser, you might reduce code execution time by using C-.001 or C-.0001 in place of C-.0254 to turn your laser on; however, I don't think this has any bearing on the issue of the lines.

When you did the small butterfly image, did you use the same feed rate of 120ipm? 

Mach3 is supposed to be able to handle 10 million lines of gcode, but I don't see how file size can be an issue.  If the computer is too slow, you should see the X axis hesitating and not the Y axis skipping lines I would think.  What version of Mach3 are you using?
John


I paint with a blue light beam.
 
Dave Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 12:42 | Üzenet/Post # 266
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The issue with mach3 that I had on large files I'm sure is due to the amount of ram on my pc. That can force excess paging which in turn can slow things down in mach3. Then of course if there are other programs taking up cpu cycles (like antivirus programs for example) that can also interfere with mach3's ability to run smoothly. If the pc is a laptop then there are power management things that can also get in the way.
If you're using the Z direction pin as the laser trigger, you need to use a Z 'depth' that takes at least one motor step or mach won't issue a step pulse. With the digital/analog circuit I had issues with a small Z movement in mach3 because CV rounds things off to the point where it didn't issue a step pulse in spots. That might not be a problem when running in ttl mode with pep because of the way it has the plunges/retracts isolated in the g-code.
Dave
 
picengraver Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 13:37 | Üzenet/Post # 267
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Hi Jerry,
I just tried your code snippet on my new machine, and it runs good with no lines. I ran it with X at .5 scale and Y at 1.0 scale so it would fit my
machine.
 
Looking at your images it is difficult to pinpoint where your trouble is; mechanical or electrical, but I suspect it is electrical since it
does not seem possible that a mechanical issue would burn heavy black lines and
also skip lines completely in the same image.  Same reasoning for it probably not being Mach3 or your computer.  Perhaps posting screen images of your Mach3 configuration settings would help.
John


I paint with a blue light beam.
 
Muk Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 14:00 | Üzenet/Post # 268
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Also Jerry, I really think you should run some code of just basic shapes to rule out PEP's code. Not that I think there is anything there, but I just want to see if it is 100% Mach 3 or if it is something more.

I know that Mach 3 can argue with the files that PEP feeds into it because of the aforementioned issues John and Dave are talking about. File size chews up my little PC that I use from time to time as well.
 
picengraver Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 14:38 | Üzenet/Post # 269
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Jerry,
I can't make out from your earlier posted image what desktop computer you are using, but have you tried a different computer?  I have an old Dell Dimension L1000R desktop (looks similar to the one on your earlier posting) that absolutely will not run Mach3 well, while another 4 Dells (GX270s) I have run it well.  It has something to do with the motherboard or pport.  On my new machine I am using a Dell laptop with a UC100 USB Motion Controller, and it works very well, too.
http://www.machsupport.com/software/downloads-updates/plugins/

John


I paint with a blue light beam.
 
Honk Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 18:10 | Üzenet/Post # 270
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Hi John
I got a ton of things going on so I might get mixed up but here goes. Mach3 version R3.043.066.  Computer is home built it is not Dell it has a 1Ghtz Athlon processor. but I found out I must have barrowed some Ram, it's only 512 Mb (I will up to 1Gb at least) I'll see what I got in the box. I added the Ground wire Dave mentioned and it did something I am not sure what yet. It was hard to get Mach started the Watch Dog was turned on and it had to work a bit to figure out what I did after I turned it off.(There might have been a problem there). I did another start of that program and after a bit it started to do real good. Its to soon to tell anything, but it sure looks better. See this Youtube and see if you think the speed is okay http://youtu.be/D2lO6z3J_-4 .   Buy the way turning off that Watch Dog in Mach3 did a lot of things. So I am going to re-draw the program from scratch and see what happens.  If it goes as good as it did when I turned it off I'll say HOORY, HOORY  when I turn it on again. The second picture is a close up of how it started, I'll get some more ram in and try it again
Thanks Jerry
PS: Any suggestions on the set up for speed IPM. C settings or anything else I'll be happy to try them.
PSS: Maybe I need to warm things up at first? ( More )
1

100%

Csatolások/Attachments: 6421827.jpg(58Kb) · 5970153.jpg(58Kb)


Az üzenetet módosította/Modified by Honk - Szerda, 2013-07-10, 18:15
 
Muk Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 18:32 | Üzenet/Post # 271
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512mb of ram? That is definitely a problem one way or another. Specifically causing something? Who knows...but if your running a 50MB g-code file...you need more ram anyway. At least 1 GB if you can swing it, push it to 2GB to be safe. Mach 3 is hungry for power when it runs to be 100%.

Also make sure your Mach is running on 25khz so that your processor can keep up.

The watchdog is to make sure that the computer isn't lagging out too badly and messing up Mach.
 
picengraver Dátum/Date: Szerda, 2013-07-10, 19:39 | Üzenet/Post # 272
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Jerry,
Mach3 watchdog can cause problems.  I run with it off, and I've seen this advised to others before on the Mach3 forums.

Don't change too much at one time, else you may lose track of the changes.

John

Hozzáadva (2013-07-10, 19:39)
---------------------------------------------
Jerry,
If you continue to have the line problem, there may be other emf noise issues with your system.  First, be sure you have the debounce interval set to something other than 0 in Gen. Config (try 2000).  Also, installing 0.1 ceramic capacitors on all input lines and a ground connection (I even use them sometimes on output lines as well) may also help reduce noise interference.
John


I paint with a blue light beam.

Az üzenetet módosította/Modified by picengraver - Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 11:30
 
Muk Dátum/Date: Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 02:32 | Üzenet/Post # 273
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John,

Ceramic caps, of course! Those work great for pulling out a bit of noise and interference!

Hozzáadva (2013-07-11, 02:32)
---------------------------------------------
Just a little project I finished today. Needed a fan for my vacuum table compressor...ended up getting an air cooler for my coolant fluid. Combine the two and a bit of paint =D



 
picengraver Dátum/Date: Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 02:35 | Üzenet/Post # 274
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thumb

I paint with a blue light beam.
 
Honk Dátum/Date: Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 16:47 | Üzenet/Post # 275
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John
Speaking of loosing track of the change. I messed up now, I switched my BobCad software over to plasma to use with my laser and when I switched beck to mill it will not post. I know it is probably a problem BobCad will need to help me with but I can't afford them. If anyone knows which click I didn't click please? I would be ever grateful
Thanks Jerry

Hozzáadva (2013-07-11, 16:47)
---------------------------------------------
Laser temp?
My cooler will keep the water temp around ambient. But Fahrenheit not Celsius. I can convert but I have trouble in relating because the scale is twice as big. So if you tell me in Celsius tell me between  what and what and if you tell me the Fahrenheit tell me the High and Low. Now for the big question! How hot should the big glass thing in the back get before I need to leave the room? Our ambient will sometimes get up to 95 F or 35 C but 35 F is a worm day here in the winter.
Thanks Jerry


Az üzenetet módosította/Modified by Honk - Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 17:27
 
Muk Dátum/Date: Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 18:33 | Üzenet/Post # 276
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From what I understand when you get higher water temperatures...your laser performance suffers until eventually it just refuses to output any power at all.

What limit that is, I'm honestly not sure. I like to keep mine no higher than 27C (81F) but that's personal preference, no science behind it.
 
picengraver Dátum/Date: Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 20:11 | Üzenet/Post # 277
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Jerry,
Sorry but can't help with BobCad.  Try Googling it.  You can't be the only user with that issue.

BTW, meant to say set your debounce to 2000 as a start in Mach3 if you have not already set it.  Hope it helps.
John


I paint with a blue light beam.

Az üzenetet módosította/Modified by picengraver - Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 20:12
 
tweakie Dátum/Date: Csütörtök, 2013-07-11, 22:15 | Üzenet/Post # 278
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With regard to water temperature...

Experimentation, by myself and others, has shown that with a CO2 laser tube the best performance is achieved with the water temperature at 8 deg.C and performance starts to drop off rapidly once the water temperature starts to exceed 25 deg.C.
From this it may be considered that the use of a refrigerated water chiller would be beneficial but (dependant on relative humidity) cooling the tube to a temperature greatly below the ambient always runs the risk of condensation forming on the outer surface of the output coupler and / or (depending on distance) the front surface of the first mirror - both of which are bad news.

Overall, I think that machine operation with a water temperature of 15 - 20 deg.C is a pretty good compromise and would be something to aim for.

Tweakie.


Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm.
 
Dave Dátum/Date: Péntek, 2013-07-12, 01:55 | Üzenet/Post # 279
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I'm clueless about bobcad, but maybe this might help?
http://www.bobcad.com/wp-cont....ser.pdf

Today's playtime session - engraved music box.... now I just need to get the movement for it biggrin
Surprisingly, the co2 laser doesn't seem to darken the wood like the diode laser did, it mostly vaporises it instead.

Dave

Csatolások/Attachments: 8272156.jpg(42Kb) · 3907676.jpg(36Kb)


Az üzenetet módosította/Modified by Dave - Péntek, 2013-07-12, 01:58
 
Muk Dátum/Date: Péntek, 2013-07-12, 02:20 | Üzenet/Post # 280
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Ooooh, pretty!

I've been using http://www.makercase.com/ for my box making stuff, is there a place where to get the hinged designs? I'm prone to making mistakes in Cad still :P
 
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